Paul: Sonia, you came back to the United States and went to work for EIRIS, a leading SRI research firm.

Sonia: That’s right. I ran the Boston office where I learned a lot about corporate social responsibility (CSR) and how to ask companies the types of questions that elicit change. As a traditional financial analyst, I didn’t know how to get a thoughtful response or how to press when I didn’t get a helpful answer.

Paul: Then in 2009 you joined ZAM as SRI director.

Sonia: Yes, to help the firm focus on research and advocacy and acquire new clients, which is typically by referral. Robert’s rationale is the more people we know, the faster the word spreads.

Paul: Robert, what led you to choose Sonia for that role? 

Robert: I interviewed Sonia and found this very imaginative, inquisitive, thoughtful person who had traveled the world with her husband James without a lot of money. And Sonia knew three times as many people in the SRI world as I did. Sonia was the eighth person to join us. Prior to that, we didn’t have the resources for shareholder advocacy and networking with others in the field. Since then, she’s delivered everything we hoped for and more. 

Paul: Robert, did you start ZAM as an employee-owned and managed firm?

Robert: No, when I started in 1997, I was the only full-time employee—I had a part-time secretary. We began adding people to our investment team in 2007, and in 2010 we turned it into a company owned by all the employees except for me. We used the LLC, but today I would use a worker-owned coop.

Everyone who has been with the firm for two years is a shareholder. Everyone sees the financial reports, total payroll and expenses and interviews new hires. It's very collegial with flat decision making and pay structure.

Paul: Sonia, in 2014 you became president of ZAM, in addition to your investment responsibilities.

Sonia: Yes, and the most positive part is that Ben Lovell, who had been president for a number of years, is still here. Ben was commuting from Maine to Boston every day so something had to give. I also joined the board of managers, which oversees the decision making but is very transparent. We do a lot of listening and interpreting—so president is not a traditional telling people what to do role.

Paul: Sonia, as a millennial, can you talk about your interaction with presidents of other firms?

Sonia: I got very positive notes from other female presidents when my new role was announced! From the outside, I can understand why it might seem strange because I'm young and come from the social issues side of the business rather than the investment side. But given the way we operate it makes sense. And Robert is not a traditional guy, and we're not a traditional firm.

Paul: Robert, you've been doing this work for a long time. How has it changed, and what’s on the horizon?