Which ingredients?
I get asked that a lot. I would look to a region and ask, what does that region excel at producing? One could say the Northeast produces wheat really well. We’re sitting in Tarrytown. In Dutch, tarwe is wheat, so it’s wheat town. So it’s not just eating the wheat, it would be eating all the crops that make wheat taste good, like barley and buckwheat and rye and leguminous crops. I don’t say don’t eat meat, but I think the proportions are out of whack. It’s about putting those proportions back together in a way that responds to what the ecological conditions dictate. It’s about eating a smattering of meat, with grains as a base and vegetables in really diverse ways.
For farmers, changing methods is expensive, whether it's diversifying crops or going cage-free. Where does the investment capital come from?
I don’t know that it’s an investment problem as much as it is a culture shift. The investment isn't going to come without it. Why would somebody invest money in making a farmer diversify his or her crops if, at the end of the day, there’s no market for it? If we’re not eating the rye and the buckwheat and all these other things that are good for us, good for the soil, and good for the planet, what’s the point?
But aren’t we starting to eat those things more?
We are, but it’s just a start. The bright side is that supermarket shelves changed more in the last five years than the last 50 years. People are looking for ingredients that they can pronounce. People in the food industry say they’ve never seen anything like it. They're like, 'What the f--- is going on?' And now the problem is finding farmers to supply organic or supply whatever it is. It’s a transition period. Who’s gonna make the investment?
Excuse the pun, but it feels like a chicken-and-egg problem.
You’re right.
We don't hear enough about the people making our food—in the fields, in the processing plant, in the kitchens. How do you bring more attention to these people?
That’s a great question, and I would admit that I do very little to bring these issues to light. [In the short term] I think all roads lead to immigration reform. You can’t have these kinds of ideals without an increase in the labor. The long game, though, isn’t to answer it with immigration, it's to change the culture where farming a piece of land, whether it’s part-time or full-time, gives you a good income and a reason to stay on the farm. That would be the goal. The culture right now is that if you’re a good student and you do well in school, you’re off the farm. That kind of thinking really needs to change. That’s very hard to do.